Porzingis and the "Process"
- Thread starter nardibynature123
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Just wanting to hear ND's opinion. I am not a Knick fan, so I really don't care. I do think your point about him wanting to play in the CoDB is a fair point.
By the way, to everyone outside of the CoP, the tanking is probably going for 3 more years because of Embiid.
That's just not correct. Colangelo didn't come here to tank. He's too old for that. With the incoming assets and slew of #1 picks and #CAPSPACE tanking is basically out of the equation going forward.
gdog
How can you say the 6ers will have more talent then the knicks in a couple yrs?
The knicks have a nice bunch of young players.......the 6ers are a mess...Okafor already looks disinterested ...the knicks have done more in 1 yr then the 6ers have done in 5.......We will have to see what they do with all the picks, but they have squandered a lot already.
How can you say the 6ers will have more talent then the knicks in a couple yrs?
The knicks have a nice bunch of young players.......the 6ers are a mess...Okafor already looks disinterested ...the knicks have done more in 1 yr then the 6ers have done in 5.......We will have to see what they do with all the picks, but they have squandered a lot already.
well, that explains it
i knew hinkie didn't want okafor
f--k andy miller and whatever the deadspin smacked ass's name is
colangelo is a f--king scumbag opportunist whose first move was dumber than anything hinkie's done
i knew hinkie didn't want okafor
f--k andy miller and whatever the deadspin smacked ass's name is
colangelo is a f--king scumbag opportunist whose first move was dumber than anything hinkie's done
False. Okafor is a less athletic version of Amare. Smart Knicks fans wanted Towns.
this wasn't why hinkie f--ked up and took okafor
i wanted to believe it, but i know better
that was a sad old day
i wanted to believe it, but i know better
that was a sad old day
A bunch of nice young players on the Knicks? Uh, who? Melo will be done at the highest level in a couple years. What do they really have besides Zinger? You do realize the Sixers will be adding at least 3 high profile guys in Saric, Embiid, Simmons/Ingram and maybe the Lakers pick if not this year then next. That Heat pick may even creep into the back of the lottery. Even if Embiid can't stay healthy the team will be adding a ton in the next 1-2 yrs without even discussing free agency. I would rather be the Sixers going forward than the Knicks, yes. Judging the Sixers off their roster today is retarded. The Knicks don't even have a pick in this draft. The Sixers will have at least 3 first rounders and maybe 2 top 5 picks and potentially 3 lottery picks plus Saric and the wild card Embiid. But you'd rather be the Knicks going forward?
Every Sixers' fan wanted Towns. Yea, every single one. Why? Best player in draft. So, it had nothing to do with smart Knixks' fans. More like common sense Knoxks' fans.
Oh yea, Towns went #1. When he was gone most Knicks' fans didn't want the Zinger. In fact, a lot of them booed the pick.
Everyone wanted Towns. But you can't get a guy who goes #1. Just like Wiggins. Knicks fans were praying the Sixers didn't take Okafor at 3. Don't kid yourself.
Stop!!!
The Knicks are in purgatory, 3 games under .500, and currently the 10th seed in east. They are respectable because they have vets. Melo is still good, but moving away from his ceiling by the month. He's not getting any better. Calderon, Lopez, and Affalo played 25 seasons combined coming into this year. Even guys like Williams and Thomas have been in the league longer than every Sixer rotation played except for Smith.
The Knicks will have no 1st RD pick next year. Affalo/Williams have player options. Cap is going up, they'll more than likely opt out. If not, the Knicks will overpay to keep and that will eat into what they could have available. They could have enough to sign a max player, but who? Mike Conley? Probably not.
Talk of them going after Teague in a trade. Who do they have that ATL would take back? I'll tell you. No one.
The Sixers are in far greater position to be creative. Way more CAP SPACE, more young players they could move, and 7 1st RD picks over next 3 years.
NickleDimer
Post 'Til Your Fingers Bleed
I'm not interested in be dating the draft rankings.
It's clear that Hinkie is ****ing up with agents/players. The agent they are talking about is also Noel's and Hollis Thompson's agent (and Lowry/Wayns/Pena). It all sounds a lot like the Chip Kelly situation. Hopefully it ends the same way.
It's clear that Hinkie is ****ing up with agents/players. The agent they are talking about is also Noel's and Hollis Thompson's agent (and Lowry/Wayns/Pena). It all sounds a lot like the Chip Kelly situation. Hopefully it ends the same way.
The mistake is thinking the draft guarantees pieces. If somehow they don't get a top two pick then what. The Heat pick might enable the Sixers to draft another Staskus. This draft sucks.
maybe okafor and their pick can move them up from 3 or 4 into the top 2
myles turner is better than him. christ what a f--king blunder
myles turner is better than him. christ what a f--king blunder
There were never any guarantees. This message has always been clear. Hinkie has said it multiple times. I know I've said it at least 100 times on this board. It's still the best way to try and get viable. You need a stud and a couple of other good players in place to eventually attract a couple of FAs, maybe. Or, you need some young players, picks, and CAP SPACE to have the potential to MAYBE get creative. Going 36-46, picking 11th, use CAP SPACE on 3rd tier FAs is a lesser option. Really, not hard to understand.
I believe the #1 reason JC was brought in. His credibility should help in this area. I'm not really concerned that some agents are ass-hurt because Hinkie wouldn't give their 3rd tier FA 44 million over 4 years. Agents see a ton of money sitting with the Sixers and are mad that they weren't ready to use it.
Who cares? It's sports, not life and death. If in the end they be one viable then no one will remember or care about 3-4 awful years.
Yea, the laughing stock who hasn't had the worst record and might not again this year.
The 6ers have more chances to strike gold, but like adp said above, there is no guarantees......Take a look at the past 3-4 yrs and who the 6ers have gotten with their 1st round picks......carter williams will be out of the league soon.....Noel will never be an offensive force so he will need to be surrounded with good scorers......embid may never play........Okafor will probably end up with a ceiling like Boozer..........So the 6ers wait yr in and yr out hoping to find a Lebron James .......And watch out with this Simmons kid......I see more Tim Thomas in him then Magic Johnson...
When you talk about the knicks you are assuming what they have leaves......Melo can play 5 more yrs......Zinger is going to be better then anyone the 6ers have now......galloway and williams are young.....Aflalo is a player.........You have to start somewhere and Phil Jackson has done a very nice job.......
It is easy to tank like the 6ers have done over the past 4 yrs.........amazing more teams don't try it, but at least the knicks have the integrity to try.........
When you talk about the knicks you are assuming what they have leaves......Melo can play 5 more yrs......Zinger is going to be better then anyone the 6ers have now......galloway and williams are young.....Aflalo is a player.........You have to start somewhere and Phil Jackson has done a very nice job.......
It is easy to tank like the 6ers have done over the past 4 yrs.........amazing more teams don't try it, but at least the knicks have the integrity to try.........
yeah dirk tim thomas led the nation in rebounding and averaged 5+ assists a game. sure
how much integrity did it take for the knicks to shut down a guy they'd just given a max extension after he played in the ASG last year?
the agent wanted his player in new york. this is far less of a referendum on hinkie than this anti-intellectual deadspin twit would have you think
carter-williams was taken 11th and traded for a top 3 protected pick. yeah terrible job by hinkie there
again i will shout into the void that noel's offensive limitations aren't really a big deal. warriors don't throw the ball in to bogut, heat rarely posted their bigs, spurs haven't played through duncan in the last five years. hinkie was able to swoop in after five dipshits passed on noel, and get another first round pick back for jrue holiday
afflalo is a good player. wasn't going to sign in philly
hinkie's only mistake was taking okafor. i doubt embiid ever gets healthy, but it will be pretty f--ked up if he does just as this scumbag colangelo pushes hinkie out the door
how much integrity did it take for the knicks to shut down a guy they'd just given a max extension after he played in the ASG last year?
the agent wanted his player in new york. this is far less of a referendum on hinkie than this anti-intellectual deadspin twit would have you think
carter-williams was taken 11th and traded for a top 3 protected pick. yeah terrible job by hinkie there
again i will shout into the void that noel's offensive limitations aren't really a big deal. warriors don't throw the ball in to bogut, heat rarely posted their bigs, spurs haven't played through duncan in the last five years. hinkie was able to swoop in after five dipshits passed on noel, and get another first round pick back for jrue holiday
afflalo is a good player. wasn't going to sign in philly
hinkie's only mistake was taking okafor. i doubt embiid ever gets healthy, but it will be pretty f--ked up if he does just as this scumbag colangelo pushes hinkie out the door
Yea, the Knicks really tried last year.
Oh yea, there are no guarantees with any method. Including the one the Knicks are using.
Concerning the 2015-2016 NBA season and the Sixers and Knicks. There is one unavoidable fact. Both have 0% chance winning a title. The difference between two teams today is that one incorporates vets, who also has an still relevant star, albeit one on the decline. He's not getting any better. He's been in the league 12 years. The Sixers rotation consists of guys with two years of experience or less. They are woefully young. And I'm not saying all of them are impactful NBA players in 3-5 years because they're not. But that's why they have 7 wins to date. If they wanted to go out and get a Calderon, Lopez, Affalo, then could have done that and won 25-30 games this year.
Trust me, but the Knicks and Jackson aren't doing anything special. They were fortunate to land Zinger. Maybe, in time he's a top 5-7 player and they can build around him. Yes, possible. But remember no guarantees, right? Or does that only pertain to Sixers?
Affalo is nice NBA vet. Solid player. He has a player option at 8 mil. The cap is going up to about 90 mil next year. I'd be shocked if he doesn't opt out and possibly double that. No way D. Williams is not opting out when only at 4.5 mil.
This is Williams 5th year on the league. He's older, more experience than every Sixers rotation guy.
Galloway is ok. Happy for him because I liked him at St. Joe's. Grant might have a place in this league, too. But neither are anymore a sure thing than young Sixers like Covington, J, Grant, possibly Holmes. In fact, I'd venture to say those Sixers have more upside as rotation guys down the line.
You're a Knicks fan and with that is an inflated opinion of their personal.
Oh yea, MCW probably won't ever be an elite player. Maybe, a starter on 4-8 seeded playoff team, or back-up on something better. But bearing catastrophic injury he'll be in this league 10-12 years, minimum. So, no, he won't be out of the league soon.
And this is year 3 of the tank.
Simmons reminds you of Tim Thomas? Why do I even bother sometimes.
Oh yea, there are no guarantees with any method. Including the one the Knicks are using.
Concerning the 2015-2016 NBA season and the Sixers and Knicks. There is one unavoidable fact. Both have 0% chance winning a title. The difference between two teams today is that one incorporates vets, who also has an still relevant star, albeit one on the decline. He's not getting any better. He's been in the league 12 years. The Sixers rotation consists of guys with two years of experience or less. They are woefully young. And I'm not saying all of them are impactful NBA players in 3-5 years because they're not. But that's why they have 7 wins to date. If they wanted to go out and get a Calderon, Lopez, Affalo, then could have done that and won 25-30 games this year.
Trust me, but the Knicks and Jackson aren't doing anything special. They were fortunate to land Zinger. Maybe, in time he's a top 5-7 player and they can build around him. Yes, possible. But remember no guarantees, right? Or does that only pertain to Sixers?
Affalo is nice NBA vet. Solid player. He has a player option at 8 mil. The cap is going up to about 90 mil next year. I'd be shocked if he doesn't opt out and possibly double that. No way D. Williams is not opting out when only at 4.5 mil.
This is Williams 5th year on the league. He's older, more experience than every Sixers rotation guy.
Galloway is ok. Happy for him because I liked him at St. Joe's. Grant might have a place in this league, too. But neither are anymore a sure thing than young Sixers like Covington, J, Grant, possibly Holmes. In fact, I'd venture to say those Sixers have more upside as rotation guys down the line.
You're a Knicks fan and with that is an inflated opinion of their personal.
Oh yea, MCW probably won't ever be an elite player. Maybe, a starter on 4-8 seeded playoff team, or back-up on something better. But bearing catastrophic injury he'll be in this league 10-12 years, minimum. So, no, he won't be out of the league soon.
And this is year 3 of the tank.
Simmons reminds you of Tim Thomas? Why do I even bother sometimes.
johnny
You just listed four 1st round picks by the 6ers that haven't amounted to much unless you are counting the mountain of wins they have posted over these 3-4 yrs.....So what is the guarantee that they strike it rich moving forward??
Have you seen Simmons play?? He coasts a lot......Tim Thomas had quite a yr as a freshman if you have forgotten...........Maybe a better comparison is that big guard from NJ that went to UCLA..Slow Mo they called him......played for Hurley at St Anth's a few yrs ago. Kyle Anderson....very talented, motor issues
And here is something else about the NBA.......It is dominated for era's at a time.....It is in the Lebron era and Curry taking over.......Before it was wade, duncan, kobe and shaq.......What can you do?? You have to keep fielding teams and competing.........How long can you tank and hope you get the next guy that is going to be a superstar.....
You just listed four 1st round picks by the 6ers that haven't amounted to much unless you are counting the mountain of wins they have posted over these 3-4 yrs.....So what is the guarantee that they strike it rich moving forward??
Have you seen Simmons play?? He coasts a lot......Tim Thomas had quite a yr as a freshman if you have forgotten...........Maybe a better comparison is that big guard from NJ that went to UCLA..Slow Mo they called him......played for Hurley at St Anth's a few yrs ago. Kyle Anderson....very talented, motor issues
And here is something else about the NBA.......It is dominated for era's at a time.....It is in the Lebron era and Curry taking over.......Before it was wade, duncan, kobe and shaq.......What can you do?? You have to keep fielding teams and competing.........How long can you tank and hope you get the next guy that is going to be a superstar.....
Tim Thomas' motor I am referring to....TT was not a ball handler...I know that, but he had mega talent, but not the heart of a lebron as an example. There are a ton of talented guys throughout the yrs that never cut it because they lack the drive.....so you are banking on finding a needle in a haystack.......
And as for not tanking.......that is why you charge money to go see games and try to make the playoffs.....It is why you are fans......I know the knicks aren't going to win the championship, but there are only about 3-4 teams every yr that have a legit chance. Why play at all if you are not going to give your fans something to attract them to go to games or watch on TV.......When I see the 6ers on, I chuckle, wonder how much they are going to lose by or what losing streak they are on. Let the fans go for free then for a few yrs till you deem that you are going to try........
And as for not tanking.......that is why you charge money to go see games and try to make the playoffs.....It is why you are fans......I know the knicks aren't going to win the championship, but there are only about 3-4 teams every yr that have a legit chance. Why play at all if you are not going to give your fans something to attract them to go to games or watch on TV.......When I see the 6ers on, I chuckle, wonder how much they are going to lose by or what losing streak they are on. Let the fans go for free then for a few yrs till you deem that you are going to try........
JG, I need more info on why JC is a scumbag? I never really followed him.
I get the executive of the year stuff, but they never won a title. Again, they don't grow on trees. I get the USA stuff, but actuality how hard could it be to assemble that squad. So, when they brought him in I wasn't all gaga over it based on those achievements. Still, I do think he's respected by most people in the NBA circle and I think that can only help.
I'm not necessarily convinced that Hinkie will get pushed out the door. For one, Hinkie didn't put a gun to ownership's head. They signed off on his idea from get-go. I think JC was brought in to teach Hinkie in some of the areas he was lacking in, i.e. Dealing with agents, etc. he gives them instant credibility. He helps calm some of the tension that was there. I think if they go after players JC can assist in brokering these types of deals. It could end up being an ideal partnership in some ways. Of course, I'm an optimist.
I get the executive of the year stuff, but they never won a title. Again, they don't grow on trees. I get the USA stuff, but actuality how hard could it be to assemble that squad. So, when they brought him in I wasn't all gaga over it based on those achievements. Still, I do think he's respected by most people in the NBA circle and I think that can only help.
I'm not necessarily convinced that Hinkie will get pushed out the door. For one, Hinkie didn't put a gun to ownership's head. They signed off on his idea from get-go. I think JC was brought in to teach Hinkie in some of the areas he was lacking in, i.e. Dealing with agents, etc. he gives them instant credibility. He helps calm some of the tension that was there. I think if they go after players JC can assist in brokering these types of deals. It could end up being an ideal partnership in some ways. Of course, I'm an optimist.
Where I agree with you is that the tank theory can't go on forever. However, it's year 3, and I believe they are getting closer to taking the next step. I base that off of everything they have in place: Young players, multiple picks, and huge amount of money to spend.
Winning a title in this league is always going to be hard. It's the nature of the league and there is nothing anyone can do about it. My only hope/wish all along is that some day they became viable. Maybe, a top 3-4 conference team, with mostly younger players, who grew together, and maybe eventually got into a possible title conversation some day.
Winning a title in this league is always going to be hard. It's the nature of the league and there is nothing anyone can do about it. My only hope/wish all along is that some day they became viable. Maybe, a top 3-4 conference team, with mostly younger players, who grew together, and maybe eventually got into a possible title conversation some day.
NickleDimer
Post 'Til Your Fingers Bleed
If you truly think Okafor is such a mutt, then you should be more unhappy with Hinkie than you are showing.
Explain why the Knicks were "fortunate to land Zinger". I don't have time to read some long winded multi-paragraph response. Explain it in 3 sentences or less.
Because....
He's a good player and looks like he's going to be very good. Because two teams passed on him prior to their pick. He was still an unknown for the most part and no one thought he be as good as he is right now. Lastly, he didn't break his foot in some pre-draft workout. Sorry for going over the three sentence max.
Yea, history proves that. Next.....
i must have missed all of the great FAs flying to the CoDB over the last 15 years of irrelevance.
FAs not ever coming to Philly is a myth, but you need one of two things. One, a core group that needs a star to complete it or a semi-star to put it over the top. Two, enough flexibility (ie assets/CAP SPACE) to pull-off a coup and grab multiple stars in one offseason. The Sixers are working towards both of those options. Won't be easy, not a guarantee, but not far-fetched either.