Cliff Lee as a Phillie remembered
- Thread starter Sportsboss_ofnothing
- Start date
Think you have to go back to the late 90's for a Phils season this bereft of anticipation
Posted from Rivals Mobile
Posted from Rivals Mobile
If he just had the surgery last year, he'd be back by June this year. Now he's screwed this year and most of next. Career basically over.
Posted from Rivals Mobile
Posted from Rivals Mobile
NickleDimer
Post 'Til Your Fingers Bleed
Is it a stretch to blame the mismanagement of the Phillies starters by Manuel/Dubee as one of the reasons for the end of Halladay and possible now Lee's career? Think of how many games they were both allowed to finish or pitch deep into when the Phillies had a comfortable lead.
I don't fully blame it on just that, both pitchers were up there in age and had a ton of innings pitched. But maybe if they were managed a little better the decline would not have been so steep?
I don't fully blame it on just that, both pitchers were up there in age and had a ton of innings pitched. But maybe if they were managed a little better the decline would not have been so steep?
the arm was not meant to take the type of punishment a pitcher places on the joints and ligaments. its always just a matter of time before the elbow or shoulder gives out. that is why most teams do not like giving long term deals to pitchers. itll happen to Hamels and Kershaw and all the other top pitchers eventually.
look how Halladay went from best pitcher in baseball to retired in 14 months.
look how Halladay went from best pitcher in baseball to retired in 14 months.
Without PEDs and HGH, this is normal. You hit that wall hard and almost with warning.
Also blaming the manager from 3 years ago is laughable. You sound like an Obama apologist still blaming Bush for shit.
Posted from Rivals Mobile
Also blaming the manager from 3 years ago is laughable. You sound like an Obama apologist still blaming Bush for shit.
Posted from Rivals Mobile
NickleDimer
Post 'Til Your Fingers Bleed
Halladay always credited the development of his changeup to Dubee. But I agree, overall he did nothing to help develop the younger pitchers. If anything he hindered their development.
NickleDimer
Post 'Til Your Fingers Bleed
Gr8 point. He "helped" the white hot can't miss pitching prospect Cole Hamels by not getting in his way too much.
Almost better to get a still relatively young pitcher who has the TJ surgery "out of the way".
With Halladay, he got tons of mileage out of his arm, just got to around 34 and that was it. Post roids pretty much every power pitcher is going to hit the wall by 35.
It seems that the world has righted the ship and the phils have returned their normal state of being historically bad. This 2015 phillies teams reminds me a lot of the 2010 Mets. So far from being good, just a lot of veterans wishing it was 5-7 years earlier.
I don't blame managers for letting starters finish games, it's almost always the pitchers choice anyway.
I don't blame managers for letting starters finish games, it's almost always the pitchers choice anyway.
News doesn't sound good. Going to rest and then throw and see if discomfort persists. If not, surgery will happen. Why exactly did he not have the surgery last year? He could have been back by June if that was the case.
If he had the surgery last year, he'd be back this year and be an absolute shell of what he once was, sort of like Roy after the shoulder surgery. Big loss. Writing clearly is on the wall here, barring a miracle he's done no matter what, and, it's now clear based on this recurrence, has been since last year. This is not a TJ surgery he would need to have, some other type of ligament repair. He will not come back stronger or close to what he was.
The travesty with Lee remains the trade to Seattle -- could have help on to him and perhaps parlayed that into another WS. Instead, one of the dumbest trades in baseball history was made.
If only whoever's office Rube walked into for sign off on that deal just fired him on the spot for being so f---ing stupid, Phils would be in a better place.
Also, it still sucks that he couldn't hold the lead in that playoff game against St. Louis -- but of course we were only playing St. Louis because Chollie was an idiot and let the Cards into the playoffs instead of San Diego, who hadn't beaten us in a couple of years.
The travesty with Lee remains the trade to Seattle -- could have help on to him and perhaps parlayed that into another WS. Instead, one of the dumbest trades in baseball history was made.
If only whoever's office Rube walked into for sign off on that deal just fired him on the spot for being so f---ing stupid, Phils would be in a better place.
Also, it still sucks that he couldn't hold the lead in that playoff game against St. Louis -- but of course we were only playing St. Louis because Chollie was an idiot and let the Cards into the playoffs instead of San Diego, who hadn't beaten us in a couple of years.
NickleDimer
Post 'Til Your Fingers Bleed
his two wins in the 09 WS were legendary, sadly he will be remember for losing against the cardinals in 2011.
Utley's 5 HRs in that 09 world series.
it was fun while it lasted.
Philly has a history of terrible GMs, Bobby Clarke, Paul Holmgren, Billy King , Rube Amaro. terrible.
Utley's 5 HRs in that 09 world series.
it was fun while it lasted.
Philly has a history of terrible GMs, Bobby Clarke, Paul Holmgren, Billy King , Rube Amaro. terrible.