Recruiting for 2013 - General
- Thread starter sebastianc
- Start date
That hurts a lot.
VU really doesn't have that much in the next class. Williams & Brislin cannot compare with what G'town is bringing in, this year. Keenan & Southerland would be an outstanding class, but I believe there is more.
Always thought the real competition was G'town. Just didn't figure VU would lose especially since their middle distance program is better. But not after this year - unless VU has some talent coming from overseas ... Is there a Jessica Judd sighting (dream on ...)?
As it stands now, VU will have to wait until next year when the real talent comes out. Or the year after. Does VU have a shot at Cain? There are several other outstanding talents in 2014 & 2015.
Has not been a good recruiting year for VU women.
Men at least have Malone & Tiernan ... But they lost Cheserek ....
This post was edited on 4/24 11:12 AM by sebastianc
VU really doesn't have that much in the next class. Williams & Brislin cannot compare with what G'town is bringing in, this year. Keenan & Southerland would be an outstanding class, but I believe there is more.
Always thought the real competition was G'town. Just didn't figure VU would lose especially since their middle distance program is better. But not after this year - unless VU has some talent coming from overseas ... Is there a Jessica Judd sighting (dream on ...)?
As it stands now, VU will have to wait until next year when the real talent comes out. Or the year after. Does VU have a shot at Cain? There are several other outstanding talents in 2014 & 2015.
Has not been a good recruiting year for VU women.
Men at least have Malone & Tiernan ... But they lost Cheserek ....
This post was edited on 4/24 11:12 AM by sebastianc
To be as kind as possible, two of the last three years have not been good for women's middle distance and xc programs. It seems the two xc championships and Reid's individual successes have not helped recruiting very muchl. If they are not bringing in anyone from abroad, the program just falls farther behind G'town.
Excattyguy, you are being kind in a way. One might have assumed that with consecutive NCAA XC championships, the outstanding female scholar-athletes would find VU attractive. Hasn't turned-out that way. In fact, G'town was actually recruiting better than VU. Look at the makeup of the team. There really are only four permier runners - Lipari, Akande, Piccirillo and Margey. Akande's success has been unexpected - a credit to Gina. The other three were nationally recognized. My point - echoing Excattyguy - is that the top women do not want to come to VU. Take a moment and think about it. The U.S, kids are not interested. Better hope they have more success with foreign students. And it is about time they looked at Britain.
This post was edited on 4/25 8:02 AM by sebastianc
This post was edited on 4/25 8:04 AM by sebastianc
This post was edited on 4/25 8:02 AM by sebastianc
This post was edited on 4/25 8:04 AM by sebastianc
They don't lose anyone of significance this summer. The important recruiting class for them is the one next year.
TFE, I would agree that the talent coming out over the next two years will be outstanding - and some of it is VU's own recruiting territory, but will VU get any of that talent? That is the real issue. One can look at the recent history and conclude that VU will try, but the talent will go elsewhere. And even on the foreign front - and there are some really good females coming out on 2014 & 2015 - VU has not been successful. Again, the issue is why do they not want to come?
I would say that in part because "full rides" in track/xc are very rare. 1/2 ride at Nova is MUCH more expensive for the kid that a full ride at FSU or Ark. Of course, that doesn't explain why they are going to Gtown, price wise it is pretty much the same as VU.
Penn women's 4x1500 is the reason you can't have an off year in recruiting, much less two out of three years. Asking the women to run three times in big relays isn't going to make it, especially if one of them is a freshman, no matter how talented. I think one of next year's recruits finished 13th in the 3000 on Thrusday. I believe it was 18 seconds behind the winning time.
Hopefully, there is someone from abroad coming in September.
Hopefully, there is someone from abroad coming in September.
Sheila Reid and Abbey D'Agostino, the two best North American born college distance runners of the last five years were largely unremarkable high school runners.
I don't know. What I do know is that Callie Hogan and Sarah Morrison had better high school PRs than Sheila did.
This post was edited on 4/26 3:09 PM by TheFoyeEffect
This post was edited on 4/26 3:09 PM by TheFoyeEffect
Callie Hogan ran very well during her first two years before she was injured. She never seemed to regain that excellence after she returned. Morrison was done before she even got to VU. Believe she was one of those females that blossomed early and faded early - all while in HS.. VU has fine moments like Reid or Akande, but you cannot maintain a good or outstanding program when you have bad recruiting years. Right now, the senior class has nothing (what happened to Neutts?), the soph class is suspect and the next class so far is questionable, but you hope to do well with the following class. So the impression is one good year alternating with a bad or so-so year. Not good.
On another front - Penn Relays possibilities:
Saw several runners that did impress. Too bad the Clark twins (Pleasantville & 4x800) are going to some junior college in Texas, which suggests poor grades. Olivia Baker (Columbia & 4x800) is only a junior. But there was the USA v World DMR. Last year, Wiliamsz ran 1200 leg for Australia. This year, Mark English ran 800 leg for Ireland. Very nice split (1:46.7), but he has to know that he is not ready for the big boys and he is not going to get ready running for DCU or UCD in Ireland. Note (mentioned earlier) that Steve Solomon (AUS) is the fastest freshman 400 man in the U.S. at Stanford. Is English still a possiblity? VU needs an 800 runner. Fitzsimons has not developed. That is unfortunate. The anchor for Great Britain - that DNF - was Matt McLaughlin (NJR indoor 1500). Did he meet with Marcus or visit VU? That would be interesting.
This post was edited on 4/28 11:05 PM by sebastianc
On another front - Penn Relays possibilities:
Saw several runners that did impress. Too bad the Clark twins (Pleasantville & 4x800) are going to some junior college in Texas, which suggests poor grades. Olivia Baker (Columbia & 4x800) is only a junior. But there was the USA v World DMR. Last year, Wiliamsz ran 1200 leg for Australia. This year, Mark English ran 800 leg for Ireland. Very nice split (1:46.7), but he has to know that he is not ready for the big boys and he is not going to get ready running for DCU or UCD in Ireland. Note (mentioned earlier) that Steve Solomon (AUS) is the fastest freshman 400 man in the U.S. at Stanford. Is English still a possiblity? VU needs an 800 runner. Fitzsimons has not developed. That is unfortunate. The anchor for Great Britain - that DNF - was Matt McLaughlin (NJR indoor 1500). Did he meet with Marcus or visit VU? That would be interesting.
This post was edited on 4/28 11:05 PM by sebastianc
sebastianic,
I wrote down some names of kids I liked in my program,
but I left my program in a restaurant before I started my
long drive home. Marcus knows that the NY Championships
will be held in Middletown, and I will be going down for those
races. I will recognize the names. I still like the girl from Elk
Lake Catholic Kennedy Weisner. As a soph she lost to Angel, I
believe, with a second in both the 800 and l500. She finished
third in the mile at Penn after leading for a short time. She is very strong
physically, and I will see what she does in the PIAA. If you have any names
of New York runners, simply list them.
Pleasantville,NJ brings back memories of fifty five years ago when
I upset them as a brash 22 year old high school BB coach.
I wrote down some names of kids I liked in my program,
but I left my program in a restaurant before I started my
long drive home. Marcus knows that the NY Championships
will be held in Middletown, and I will be going down for those
races. I will recognize the names. I still like the girl from Elk
Lake Catholic Kennedy Weisner. As a soph she lost to Angel, I
believe, with a second in both the 800 and l500. She finished
third in the mile at Penn after leading for a short time. She is very strong
physically, and I will see what she does in the PIAA. If you have any names
of New York runners, simply list them.
Pleasantville,NJ brings back memories of fifty five years ago when
I upset them as a brash 22 year old high school BB coach.
Another one to keep an eye on. Hannah Brosky from Emmaus, pa. Junior this year and ran 2:13 on Friday. She was 9th in piaa last year in 2:15. She may go under 2:10 at state meet. She won't have much competition until then, only 1 other decent girl in district 11 who could make her work for a good time.
TFE, Brislin and Williams have possibilities - and I hope they do well - but there is no indication that they are premier talents. However, I do like Brislin. Has a little speed. Spliit 2:11, last year at Penn Relays I believe.
In another thread - Penn Relays, Excattyguy posts a question about Irish runners on scholarship in U.S. And references a thread on Let's Run.
There are several. The best is probably Sarah Collins of Providence. She is listed as being from Switzerland, but family is from Cork and dad works in Switzerland. Thought VU would have had a chance since Marcus is from Cork.
Liam Markaham of Illinois is a 21 year old freshman. So his 3:46 has to be seen in that light.
Mark English was the best thing that has come along in Ireland for some time. We have discussed his coming to VU for some time, but that did not happen. TFE reported that he has signed with Adidas.
Sean Tobin just won XC championship and has 1:51.7 (800) and 3:46.4 (1500), but someone reported he is going to Mississippi St.
Best young male talent includes Shane Fitzsimons - 1:50.3 (800), 3:48 (1500). [ He is incredibly short. Maybe a male Lipari?] And Karl Griffin - 22.9 (200 i), 49.5 (400), 1:49.6 (800, NYR) - a better choice, but are there $ for him?
Best overall talent: Siofra Cleirigh-Buttner - 55.7 (400), 2:04.8 (800), 4:24.4 (1500). Set indoor NJR of 2:05.3 in January. Supposedly she is on VU's radar.
In another thread - Penn Relays, Excattyguy posts a question about Irish runners on scholarship in U.S. And references a thread on Let's Run.
There are several. The best is probably Sarah Collins of Providence. She is listed as being from Switzerland, but family is from Cork and dad works in Switzerland. Thought VU would have had a chance since Marcus is from Cork.
Liam Markaham of Illinois is a 21 year old freshman. So his 3:46 has to be seen in that light.
Mark English was the best thing that has come along in Ireland for some time. We have discussed his coming to VU for some time, but that did not happen. TFE reported that he has signed with Adidas.
Sean Tobin just won XC championship and has 1:51.7 (800) and 3:46.4 (1500), but someone reported he is going to Mississippi St.
Best young male talent includes Shane Fitzsimons - 1:50.3 (800), 3:48 (1500). [ He is incredibly short. Maybe a male Lipari?] And Karl Griffin - 22.9 (200 i), 49.5 (400), 1:49.6 (800, NYR) - a better choice, but are there $ for him?
Best overall talent: Siofra Cleirigh-Buttner - 55.7 (400), 2:04.8 (800), 4:24.4 (1500). Set indoor NJR of 2:05.3 in January. Supposedly she is on VU's radar.
I think if Marcus really wanted to, he could recruit Ireland, but Australia is producing better runners at all levels than Ireland, so it's more prudent to go there.
"but I left my program in a restaurant before I started my
long drive home."
Must have been quite a meal.
long drive home."
Must have been quite a meal.
Can't cut and paste a tweet on Rivals? However:
Ruairi Finnegan tweets that he ran an "easy" 3:50 today and hopes to run a good mile next Sat. The Irish Jr. be 19 in July and will prob' run in the Euro Jrs this summer if they're scheduled (last year was WJC).
.
Rory may be capable of a 4:00 mile in the right competition (like Cork City Sports). I think he's likely to stay at home though a la Mark English.
I also look into the possibility of a standout Natosha Rogers transfer from A&M if she has a CC season left? She's a CC title threat as well as at either 5k or 10k on the track. Long-long shot but why not ask ? She left the squad prior to indoor when she got a look at her schedule (amongst other problems). Bigtime talent.
This post was edited on 5/11 10:17 PM by Or1on
Ruairi Finnegan tweets that he ran an "easy" 3:50 today and hopes to run a good mile next Sat. The Irish Jr. be 19 in July and will prob' run in the Euro Jrs this summer if they're scheduled (last year was WJC).
.
Rory may be capable of a 4:00 mile in the right competition (like Cork City Sports). I think he's likely to stay at home though a la Mark English.
I also look into the possibility of a standout Natosha Rogers transfer from A&M if she has a CC season left? She's a CC title threat as well as at either 5k or 10k on the track. Long-long shot but why not ask ? She left the squad prior to indoor when she got a look at her schedule (amongst other problems). Bigtime talent.
This post was edited on 5/11 10:17 PM by Or1on
If one is going to go to the British Isles for talent, better bet is going to England rather than Ireland - at least for men. Finnegan is nice, but I don't believe rates a lot of $. Better bet is Matt Mclaughlin (GBR) - younger and a lot better. The Irish women, though, have several with talent - e.g., Siofra Cleirigh-Buttner ('95), Aislinn Crossey ('95), Alanna Lally ('96). Hard to figure when they graduate. For example, Cleirigh-Buttner is coming out in 2014. However, if one is going that far, then look at Jessica Judd (GBR). Full ride easily. She would make the program. Even better talent than Southerland. On par with Cain.
Thus far, the 2013 class is so-so. however, there is a young woman out there, who I Ithink fits the VU profile and has put up some outstanding numbers. Doubt anyone has picked-up on it and why she is so perfect for VU. Have to believe that Marcus and Gina are aware of her. However, VU supporters are not the only ones on this site. So keep in mind, there is a superb talent out there - who should be on VU's radar.
Final note: Gabriela Stafford (CAN) ran a 2:11.7 on 5/4 (2nd to Jamie Phelan). Believe it is her first outdoor competition. But is she graduating, this year? Or is VU looking at her? Phelan just won at Penn and is going to Michigan. VU ws supposedly interested. Stafford trounced her in XC.
Rogers? VU could use some help at XC. Believe Cook graduates; Venables hasn't developed. But VU usually doesn't do transfers.
Thus far, the 2013 class is so-so. however, there is a young woman out there, who I Ithink fits the VU profile and has put up some outstanding numbers. Doubt anyone has picked-up on it and why she is so perfect for VU. Have to believe that Marcus and Gina are aware of her. However, VU supporters are not the only ones on this site. So keep in mind, there is a superb talent out there - who should be on VU's radar.
Final note: Gabriela Stafford (CAN) ran a 2:11.7 on 5/4 (2nd to Jamie Phelan). Believe it is her first outdoor competition. But is she graduating, this year? Or is VU looking at her? Phelan just won at Penn and is going to Michigan. VU ws supposedly interested. Stafford trounced her in XC.
Rogers? VU could use some help at XC. Believe Cook graduates; Venables hasn't developed. But VU usually doesn't do transfers.
Whitecat, did you see the guy who finished second, Jonathan Greenwood (48.35)? What was he like? Reason is he is also a decent 800 guy (1:53.6). Think Ellison.
sebastianic,
I didn't go down; White Plains is almost in NYC, and I try to
stay away from there. I live just south of Colgate in Hamilton, NY.
However, I will go to Middletown on June 8 for the NY State
Championships. I read that Ryan of FM won the 3200 in 8;55+
while Coyle of LaSalle won the PCL 3200 in 9:14 or so. That is the
first time Ryan has run this season. Artis, the FM coach, has some
strange training methods.
I didn't go down; White Plains is almost in NYC, and I try to
stay away from there. I live just south of Colgate in Hamilton, NY.
However, I will go to Middletown on June 8 for the NY State
Championships. I read that Ryan of FM won the 3200 in 8;55+
while Coyle of LaSalle won the PCL 3200 in 9:14 or so. That is the
first time Ryan has run this season. Artis, the FM coach, has some
strange training methods.
Whitcat, sorry. My bad. Should have had my coffee. That was Louck, not NY State championships.
TFE, no argumentt about Judd. One can hope. Still there is talent in England. Georgia Peel is running well as a frosh at Florida State. VU should consider Lauren Bleaken - 24.8 (200), 54.9 (400 i), 2:04.6 (800), 4:38.1 (1500 - '09), XC (48th in nationals).
..
TFE, no argumentt about Judd. One can hope. Still there is talent in England. Georgia Peel is running well as a frosh at Florida State. VU should consider Lauren Bleaken - 24.8 (200), 54.9 (400 i), 2:04.6 (800), 4:38.1 (1500 - '09), XC (48th in nationals).
..
Future Villanovan Julie Williams ran in the DE state meet this w/e. She was a busy young lady.
2nd in 800M in 2:15 to Reagan Anderson
2nd in 1600M to Anderson again in 5:06
Won the 3200M, Anderson didn't run, in 10:55.
She also ran a leg on their 4x400 team.
Great weather on friday but chilly and windy on sat.
2nd in 800M in 2:15 to Reagan Anderson
2nd in 1600M to Anderson again in 5:06
Won the 3200M, Anderson didn't run, in 10:55.
She also ran a leg on their 4x400 team.
Great weather on friday but chilly and windy on sat.
Williams looks as if she'll be better at XC than on the track.
Also notable, Ben Malone ran 48.94 in an open 400. That's speed you cannot teach.
This post was edited on 5/21 3:47 PM by TheFoyeEffect
Also notable, Ben Malone ran 48.94 in an open 400. That's speed you cannot teach.
This post was edited on 5/21 3:47 PM by TheFoyeEffect
Tin Pa. in PaFE,
Ben didn't run cross country in 2012. Do you know
any reason why he did not. Does he have X Country
range?
Not much to report on Brislin(name/spelling). It seems as
if the top female hgh schoolers are juniors
Ben didn't run cross country in 2012. Do you know
any reason why he did not. Does he have X Country
range?
Not much to report on Brislin(name/spelling). It seems as
if the top female hgh schoolers are juniors
Malone didn't run cross country because he was hurt in the fall.
As for Brislin, she hasn't lost an individual outdoor race this season.
As for Brislin, she hasn't lost an individual outdoor race this season.
FM (Brislin) doesn't appear to be as heavily scheduled as in other years. I don't think they were at Penn, Loucks.
As for Srs there's some parity in Pa amongst Regan Rome, Courtney Smith, Kennedy Weisner, Tessa Barrett. All are good CCR, great students, without a lot of top-end speed. VU could get Sept visits from some or all of them. But for 800/1500 types they have to look elsewhere.
As for Srs there's some parity in Pa amongst Regan Rome, Courtney Smith, Kennedy Weisner, Tessa Barrett. All are good CCR, great students, without a lot of top-end speed. VU could get Sept visits from some or all of them. But for 800/1500 types they have to look elsewhere.
With Reagan Anderson up in New York for the Adidas GP, Julie Williams absolutely dominated the Delaware state meet.
TFE,
In the class races before the sectionals yesterday,
Brislin won the 1500 in 4:36+ and the 800 in 2:15. That makes her
still unbeaten outdoors. Will see what happens in sectionals and states.
I must put in a word for a runner for the school I taught at for 36
years. He is a junior(Matt Murray). He doubled at a big Union Endicott
Invite with 48.6 in the 400 and 1;54+ in the 800. I think he ran under
1:53 scratch last year as a soph. I don't know what his best distance might
be. I'll see at states.
In the class races before the sectionals yesterday,
Brislin won the 1500 in 4:36+ and the 800 in 2:15. That makes her
still unbeaten outdoors. Will see what happens in sectionals and states.
I must put in a word for a runner for the school I taught at for 36
years. He is a junior(Matt Murray). He doubled at a big Union Endicott
Invite with 48.6 in the 400 and 1;54+ in the 800. I think he ran under
1:53 scratch last year as a soph. I don't know what his best distance might
be. I'll see at states.
SIAP:
Sprinter Kalissa Caesar of Port Jervis, NY (55-100-200 specialist) will run for Villanova in the fall. She's got the following PRs:
55: 7.45
100: 12.34
200: 25.50
Also a 14'4" long jumper
A link to her MileSplit page is attached.
Kalissa Caesar (MileSplit)
Sprinter Kalissa Caesar of Port Jervis, NY (55-100-200 specialist) will run for Villanova in the fall. She's got the following PRs:
55: 7.45
100: 12.34
200: 25.50
Also a 14'4" long jumper
A link to her MileSplit page is attached.
Kalissa Caesar (MileSplit)
Not exactly blown away by those numbers. I assume she is a walk on. 14'4" long jumper??? My 13 year old niece can do that.
Siofra C- Buttner won the Irish Schools Sat. with an unpushed 2:03.75? I'm making my Sept.'13 visits list out --not very impressed with it so far-- and she'd probably top it. I do think though that if she cuts a few sec's off that pr she may not come over? To be determined.
I do know that VU is in touch with Siofra C-Buttner. And she is a good one. Believe she was also XC champion and recently ran 4:22.4 (1500). I think she just might come. As opposed to Mageean and English, C-Buttner has been part of a team. There is something to be said for that. Recent article (MileSplit) suggest that Cain's dad sees some virtue in her being part of a college program. However, as good as C-Buttner is, there are others who are as appealing. In fact my list for 2014 has a over a dozen truly outstanding females. The bigger issue is the seeming weakness in this year's recruiting class - especially women.
All of the major schools - G'town, Oregon, Virginia, Duke, Washington, etc - have recruited better. Procaccio has a great track record. Who would have predicted Akande's success? Reid was not the top recruit. So maybe she knows something. I want to believe so. As Whitecat reminds us, Brislin in undefeated thus far, this year. And her times are comparable to Akande's at a similar stage..
The men? They have Tiernan and Malone. And Lampron, Brennan, Corbusier and Warnick were red-shirted, this year. Obodare remains a question mark. He has yet to break 48. The men came up one leg short on each of the relays at Penn. How do they plan to make up the differences?
Side note: Ana Holland (CO) is top female 400. Went to Regis Jesuit. That is VU territory. She is going to Virginia. Was VU ever in the chase?
All of the major schools - G'town, Oregon, Virginia, Duke, Washington, etc - have recruited better. Procaccio has a great track record. Who would have predicted Akande's success? Reid was not the top recruit. So maybe she knows something. I want to believe so. As Whitecat reminds us, Brislin in undefeated thus far, this year. And her times are comparable to Akande's at a similar stage..
The men? They have Tiernan and Malone. And Lampron, Brennan, Corbusier and Warnick were red-shirted, this year. Obodare remains a question mark. He has yet to break 48. The men came up one leg short on each of the relays at Penn. How do they plan to make up the differences?
Side note: Ana Holland (CO) is top female 400. Went to Regis Jesuit. That is VU territory. She is going to Virginia. Was VU ever in the chase?