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Sixers Draft/Trade Rumors

adp98 said:
I don't watch the Sixers, I do watch the NBA. Your response to everything Okafor is they shouldn't "give him away". You don't even know what that means because you don't understand his value.
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Umm, if they give him away then I will say they gave him away and I'll say ADP was right his value wasn't as good as I believed. Ok? There are so many options out there involving different players/picks/etc that it's hard to say without knowing.

And you don't know what his value is either. You think you do. You're not in the minds of every GM in the league.

For example, I was told this one earlier today. A three-way between CHI-LAL-PHI; Bulls get Okafor, Lakers get Rose, and Sixers get Russell. I would do that and consider it fair.

You act like I said he was fetching Kevin Durant back. Also, I agree with you about his limitations and long-term ceiling. I've said since he was drafted that I believed he was drafted to be eventually be moved (Additional pundits have mentioned this recently). I'm on board with you in moving him. I just don't think he sucks and that he's as hopeless as you believe. Really, our views aren't much different and it's certainly not worth getting into a two-page argument about.
 
adp98 said:
If I can get Avery Bradley and another vet back I'm good. Unless you haven't figured it out yet, I don't think Okafor is very good and represents sunk cost. What you fail to grasp is the Sixers lack leverage. Teams look at their situation and can count. The Sixers have too many young bigs and nothing else. These other teams, take Boston, don't need to make this deal. The Sixers are on the clock because the season starts and you really don't want all these bigs heading into the season. So the onus is the Sixers to make a deal. Boston in this situation can sit back as they have multiple pieces many teams want. They will make a few deals and don't have a time table like beginning of the season. If I were Boston I'd find a way to get Kevin Love. At least he can rebound, pass, and shoot. If they will settle for Okafor because the cost is much lower find a way to get it done. Moving up the two draft picks in the back end, Avery Bradley and another vet works for me. You won't get a perfect deal because you're in a very imperfect situation and everyone knows it.
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Unless, multiple teams have interest in him and need to bid against each other. Also, if someone like Ainge, who it's been reported likes him a great deal, is just posturing and using his media influence to put stuff out there. Real offers, whether strong or not, will probably come in closer to the draft, like Wed into Thur. I do hear what you're saying, tho.

What is a perfect deal? Who stated anything about it having to be perfect? The word I have used is fair. If some of you guys just paid attention better then these squabbles wouldn't be as frequent.
 
adp98 said:
These squabbles happen because you're all over the place and hedge every statement made.
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How am I hedging? And I'm not all over the place even a little. Never once suggested something outlandish in return and have told you multiple times that I agree with you on JO's limitations and projected drawbacks over time.

I told you I don't know how I feel about that proposed trade. I'm not sure I like it, despite liking Bradley as a player.

Before you said, take a back of the lottery pick for him. I said that's not enough. Give me more examples and I'll tell you if I like it or if I think it's fair. You say get a couple of vets for him, well, specifically what vets? Not all vets are created equal.

C'mon, ADP....
 
adp98 said:
If I were Boston I'd find a way to get Kevin Love. At least he can rebound, pass, and shoot.
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I wouldn't expect Love to show any further interest in rebounding -- or playing inside at all for that matter -- unless his team finds its way back to the NBA finals and it goes 7 games. In his mind he's otherwise reached the Chris Webber stage of his career where he is "no longer does that low post thing" and will be content to jack up jumpers he's left open to shoot because he's a mediocre shooter.

In that sense, Okafor maybe a better choice. In the right situation, I could see him trying a little harder for a few years, at least until his contract is up.
 
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lowry99 said:
In his mind he's otherwise reached the Chris Webber stage of his career where he is "no longer does that low post thing" and will be content to jack up jumpers he's left open to shoot because he's a mediocre shooter.
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Either that or he makes his team better by not clogging up the lane and giving Lebron and Kyrie some space.
 
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I don't agree. Love can shoot, pass and rebound. Okafor does neither. Cleveland was a 3 point shooting team and Lebron is better when someone is not clogging the lane. Okafor doesn't have any of the offensive skills as a Kevin Love. Love is simply a poor fit in Cleveland.
 
You guys have a lot of faith in Love. Maybe you're right and he was just being accomodating. I don't know him and haven't followed his pro career closely, but I'd be reluctant to put a lot of eggs in that basket if I were a contender hoping you'd see him relish playing inside and rebounding in a different place. He seemed to really enjoy taking a lot of 3s.

He was a great passer out of the center spot from what I remember of him at UCLA, and a good inside player then and earlier. Many NBA guys seem to think they graduate beyond that though, try to preserve their bodies for the next deal, etc.
 
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lowry99 said:
You guys have a lot of faith in Love. Maybe you're right and he was just being accomodating. I don't know him and haven't followed his pro career closely, but I'd be reluctant to put a lot of eggs in that basket if I were a contender hoping you'd see him relish playing inside and rebounding in a different place. He seemed to really enjoy taking a lot of 3s.

He was a great passer out of the center spot from what I remember of him at UCLA, and a good inside player then and earlier. Many NBA guys seem to think they graduate beyond that though, try to preserve their bodies for the next deal, etc.
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You broke burrs' golden rule, admitting that you don't watch enough of him. Therefore you opinion doesn't mean shit.
 
adp98 said:
I don't agree. Love can shoot, pass and rebound. Okafor does neither. Cleveland was a 3 point shooting team and Lebron is better when someone is not clogging the lane. Okafor doesn't have any of the offensive skills as a Kevin Love. Love is simply a poor fit in Cleveland.
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But if we could rewind back to Love's rookie season ADP would be telling us Loce can't shoot or pass either because he was 2-19 from the arc and averaged 1 assist per game.

My point is not to suggest that Okafor will ever extend his game out to the arc or be Magic in his passing, but we really need to stop defining a kid's career after 53 games as a 19/20 year old.
 
Love was one of the better passing bigs we'd seen in his one year of college. His skill was very obvious. Okafor couldn't guard college players and it was very obvious. The guys are not alike in terms of skill. Okafor was the bigger kid who beat up on smaller kids. Now he's the same size and limited athletically. Not similar it at all.
 
Just saw a trade proposal between Sixers, TWolves and Bulls:

Sixers get Wiggins
Bulls get Okafor and 5th pick
TWolves get Butler and 24th pick
 
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It's quite simple with Love. If you want him to approach the 25-14 numbers then he has to be the best player on the team. The problem with that is that you won't win with him as the best player. If you want him complimenting two other players then you can get 15/16 and 9/10 a game.
 
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Love was one rebound his rookie year away from averaging a double-double each of his first 6 years in the league. All while being one of the best passing bigs in the league. This is beyond silly.
 
NickleDimer said:
^^^ new burrsian statement template. share with friends who are interested in hedging.
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How is this a hedge? Jesus Chrust you're a cheek. Saying to stop defining a player's career based off of a year or two of play is hedging? I don't get that.

You just can't have a solid conversation on this board anyone. Too many D-Heads, who find the need to be funny every single time.
 
adp98 said:
Love was one rebound his rookie year away from averaging a double-double each of his first 6 years in the league. All while being one of the best passing bigs in the league. This is beyond silly.
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Who mentioned anything about him not always being a good rebounder? Why do you bring up stuff that I didn't say?
 
Read my post again and note where that was said. See, this is why you get into this stuff. You don't even know what you're saying. I simply noted he was one board his rookie year away from being a double-double guy each of his 6 first years in the league. No one said Love was a bad rebounder because he's quite good. He's also a great passer, not good but elite. Which is why comparing him to Okafor as you and Lowry are attempting is just silly.
 
adp98 said:
Love was one of the better passing bigs we'd seen in his one year of college. His skill was very obvious. Okafor couldn't guard college players and it was very obvious. The guys are not alike in terms of skill. Okafor was the bigger kid who beat up on smaller kids. Now he's the same size and limited athletically. Not similar it at all.
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Who is comparing the two as players? Obviously, they are different. Thanks, Jerry West.
 
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adp98 said:
Read my post again and note where that was said. See, this is why you get into this stuff. You don't even know what you're saying. I simply noted he was one board his rookie year away from being a double-double guy each of his 6 first years in the league. No one said Love was a bad rebounder because he's quite good. He's also a great passer, not good but elite. Which is why comparing him to Okafor as you and Lowry are attempting is just silly.
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Not comparing them. Take a breath. Simply saying Love was 2-19 from arc as rookie. Made 35 3's following year. Averaged an assist a game as a rookie. Yes, he improved. Why? Because he was 20 and the NBA isn't easy. All I'm saying is to stop talking about Okafor like he can't/won't improve in multiple facets of the game, too.

I'm not comparing them as players. Jesus Christ....
 
Burrs5 said:
How is this a hedge?
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deny.jpg
 
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NovaHoops2002 said:
Definietley - but it was on some 3rd tier Sixers blog and as far as I can tell it's just a Twitter rumor.

But still a lineup of Simmons, Wiggins, Saric, Noel, Embiid would be very nice.
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I figured it was a weak source.
 
NovaHoops2002 said:
Definietley - but it was on some 3rd tier Sixers blog and as far as I can tell it's just a Twitter rumor.

But still a lineup of Simmons, Wiggins, Saric, Noel, Embiid would be very nice.
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Sixers season ticket cold callers would go from 6 to midnight if that happened. Too good to be true.
 
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adp98 said:
Yes, you and especially Lowry did. It's not always about just you.
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I don't think they are anything alike. I never compared their games. I commented on Love's underwhelming numbers as a younger player in two areas that you highlighted. Yes, he's good at that stuff now as he enters his late 20's. Shocker. He improved. Wow. Not my fault you can't see the difference between actually comparing players and comparing stages of development. Cmon, get better ADP.
 
Burrs5 said:
I don't think they are anything alike. I never compared their games. I commented on Love's underwhelming numbers as a younger player in two areas that you highlighted. Yes, he's good at that stuff now as he enters his late 20's. Shocker. He improved. Wow. Not my fault you can't see the difference between actually comparing players and comparing stages of development. Cmon, get better ADP.
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I highlighted 3 areas, passing, shooting and rebounding. The kid was an incredible passer from day one. His freshman year at UCLA he was hailed as the best passing big since Bill Walton. He averaged 9 boards per game in 25 minutes his rookie year. The only thing he didn't do was shoot well. He developed that later. You're simply wrong on two of the three skills I noted. He was always an 80% foul shooter as well. Did Okafor break 65% last year? Again, the skills of these guys isn't in the area code at any stage.
 
jimmy butler is a lot better than wiggins, and nobody likely to be taken at #5 is all that special, but i can't see minnesota pulling the trigger on that one

okafor is awful. just get rid of him
 
adp98 said:
I highlighted 3 areas, passing, shooting and rebounding. The kid was an incredible passer from day one. His freshman year at UCLA he was hailed as the best passing big since Bill Walton. He averaged 9 boards per game in 25 minutes his rookie year. The only thing he didn't do was shoot well. He developed that later. You're simply wrong on two of the three skills I noted.
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I know you did. I agreed with you on rebounding, so there was no need to mention it. Did you take your meds today?

He was a good passer in college (1.9 at UCLA), but didn't do much early in NBA. Fact. Okafor (1.3 at Duke) was said to pass the ball out of post well, too. Maybe, just maybe, if the Sixers had better perimeter players then we would of saw a little more of that. Just a thought.
 
Burrs5 said:
I know you did. I agreed with you on rebounding, so there was no need to mention it. Did you take your meds today?

He was a good passer in college (1.9 at UCLA), but didn't do much early in NBA. Fact. Okafor (1.3 at Duke) was said to pass the ball out of post well, too. Maybe, just maybe, if the Sixers had better perimeter players then we would of saw a little more of that. Just a thought.
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In a system where he was surrounded by shooters and he got the ball a lot he averaged 1.3 assists per game. Those who said he was a good passer probably where the same people who said he wouldn't completely suck at defense and rebounding either.
 
nardibynature2 said:
Passing is not all about assists.
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True.

Again, all I'm saying is that Love got better at this particular skill (And others) as time went on. For most guys playing in the NBA as a 19-22 year old isn't easy and it's possible that they can improve in certain areas. I mean, really? Is this unknown to people?
 
"Per league source several teams have been in contact with the Sixers about Okafor, Noel including BOS & NO."
 
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