Active Shooter in San Berdoo

[Doctor_Van]

If the info out there now is to be believed, wouldn't the most likely scenario be that they were going to do this somewhere as an act of terror, likely linked to meeting his wife online from Saudi Arabia, based On the preparedness. then something set him off at this party and he decided to make his move.

 

[SnottieDrippen]

If the info out there now is to be believed, wouldn't the most likely scenario be that they were going to do this somewhere as an act of terror, likely linked to meeting his wife online from Saudi Arabia, based On the preparedness. then something set him off at this party and he decided to make his move.

Agreed. I picture someone saying he didn't like mentioning something about the Middle East, probably not even in derogatory way, and this psycho finally snapping after years of contemplation/pestering from wife to grow balls and do it

 

[bgranc02]

Mass shootings by a sociopath of a certain race/creed... nothing can be done, 2nd amendment, some baseless rhetoric about mental health. Mass shooting by a sociopath of another race/creed and it seems people are willing to make decisions on foreign policy and believe we can fix the problem by going to war.

 

[lowry99]

Despite this guy's religious background, I'm not willing to jump the gun and say that this was Islamist terrorism yet.

My biggest question is that if it was terrorism, then why the hell would he kill a bunch of county government workers in San Bernardino? Why not a military or federal government target or better yet, a civilian target in a place that wasn't San effing Bernardino?

From what we've observed over the last 15 years and especially more recently, the most immediate terrorist goal is to kill as many people as they can. Who they are is secondary. Bonus points if it's a symbolic target, but that's not a requirement.

There's a risk/reward calculation for them too -- decide to go shoot up a stadium or other place that now has a lot of security, and you probably get caught and/or killed in the end. Shoot up a government drone Christmas party in a venue you're very familiar with, and you can kill a bunch of people and also escape, breed terror that you'll kill again as with the Paris jagoffs, maybe do some more damage.

Love how everyone wants to ignore the most plausible answer though -- contrarians going all cleanwave on us.

 

[tjc3844]

Isn't is pretty simplistic to say things can't have more than one cause?

This incident isn't about a combination of things. It's a terrorist attack. Of course, some events can be a combination of multiple factors. This is not such an event as the info coming out today is confirming.

 

[YourBuddyRayhad]

I heard they had Beefeater instead of Tanqueray at the party and it set him off

 

[Doctor_Van]

Good thing they are only brown and not black, otherwise the Black Lives Matter crowd would be all over this protesting them being shot by 20+ cops

 

[NickleDimer]

Are you saying everyone should own a gun and cable should be outlawed?

What type of channel capacity does their cable box have? How fast can you change channels? Does it require more than one click or can you just hold the channel down button? Should we preserve the right to bear remotes so that parents can quickly change the channel if unsavory programming were to invade their home? What if they only watch hunting shows? Would Greg Hardy's girlfriend have been injured if he threw her on a futon covered in cable TV remotes?

So many variables in play here. Let's either not reform anything or pick something minor and inconsequential and claim victory.

 

[RSTRICK30]

I heard they had Beefeater instead of Tanqueray at the party and it set him off

Am told that he was wished "Happy Holidays" when he entered and THAT set him off.

Goddamn War on Christmas!!

 

[NovaHoops2002]

 

[Nova98]

Honestly what does climate have to do with anything? Because we can't fix gun violence (which I mostly agree with) it means we can't try to use more clean fuel? What am I missing here?

About two weeks ago after the Paris attacks & before the global warming summit Obama made comments in a press conference on the best ways to fight ISIS. He went on to say that his attending the Global Warming summit will show ISIS that they cannot win. I'm paraphrasing slightly but basically while all the reporters were asking questions about what the US strategy to fight ISIS is & whether the US would help rally the world together in this fight his answer was basically "I'm attending the global warming summit-that will show them!!!"

 

[NovaNation1188]

Doesn't matter where Obama goes, the media will criticize him. If he didn't go to the summit, he would've been slammed for not going to an event he preaches so much about. Everyone just looking for the next headline and reason to not like him.

Pretty sure if all the money spent fighting Obamacare went to fund it, the program would've been paid for the next 10 years.

 

[adp98]

Yes, and then at dem debate, one day post paris, Bernie sanders expressed sorrow for the victims of Paris and within a second said it was global warming that is our biggest threat. It was weird even for bernie.

 

[cleanwave]

We know Turkey has been taking ISIS oil & making $$ Hundreds of Millions.

Who is the bank for Bilal Erdogan' shipping company?

What else does the $$ trail tell us

 

[NickleDimer]

Who is the bank for Bilal Erdogan' shipping company?

 

[cleanwave]

Is another BCCI around?

 

[TheDean]

I like dirtyd's "audible" theory. Guy was pent up with rage, recently radicalized, had a plan to hit a big U.S. target, but then has to endure the lame office party. I work in a Manhattan office with dozens of young, cool people - and those parties still almost always suck. Imagine how annoying the one at the "Inland Regional Center" was. It may have even been a pot luck. Maybe they didn't like his wife's biryani - and he sure as hell wasn't going to touch that nasty-looking mac-n-cheese.

If I'm sterotyping the typical social worker in San Bernandino, it isn't pretty. He's been listening to the same old dopes tell the same stupid stories for five years. There's no way he was jealous of any of them. Was he trying to put the lot of them out of their misery? He left and came back with the willing wife as a second shooter - without a solid exit or escape strategy. Left their 6-month-old baby with his mother. Left most of the pipe bombs.

Something happened that really ticked him off.

 

[NickleDimer]

Something happened that really ticked him off.

Perhaps a booger?

 

[Mr. Wade Garrett]

Of COURSE this guy was radicalized.

I get that white people do this too and we call it mental illness/ gun control. But lets be real, some lowlife Muslim and his filthy non-American wife didnt conspire to shoot up a bunch of civilians because they both suffered from the same exact illness. Theyre both scumbag radical Muslims. Stop pretending otherwise.

Save the gun control debate for when a white guy goes on a shooting spree again. Lord knows it will happen soon enough.

 

[cleanwave]

BCCI was the Pakistan HQ bank radical for jihadists & those directing them in 80's. They got busted but not a lot of people got locked up.

May be off, but be interesting to know who is Erdogans bank

& other banks arming foreign jihadist in Syria

 

[NovaTras22]

Save the gun control debate for when a white guy goes on a shooting spree again. Lord knows it will happen soon enough.

too late for some

https://imgur.com/a/ctcfc

 

[TheDean]

---The suspects had 1,600 rifle and 9-millimeter rounds with them during final pursuit with police.

--- Twenty-three officers from seven agencies were involved in the final shootout, and officers fired 380 rounds at suspects. Suspects fired 76 rounds at officers.

LOL.

Reminds me of

--- Twelve pipe bombs, 2,000 9-millimeter rounds and 2,500 .223 rounds were found at a home the suspects were renting in Redlands. Also found were “hundreds of tools, many of which could be used to construct IEDs or pipe bombs.”

Good lord. Maybe they were going to hit the Rose Bowl parade.

 

[cbb2003]

CNN now reporting shooter was in contact with foreign jihadis:

http://www.cnn.com/2015/12/03/us/san-bernardino-shooting/index.html

Paraphrasing a tweet I saw somewhere that nailed the last couple of days:

"The Republicans and the NRA are responsible for this!! The blood is on all of their hands!! Every last one of them!!

Wait, what? Who? Farook? Saudi Arabia? Muslim? IEDs?

Well, hold on now, let's not go painting with broad brushes here!!"

 

[NickleDimer]

Save the gun control debate for when a white guy goes on a shooting spree again. Lord knows it will happen soon enough.

A recent growing trend of shootings by people in the name due to stupid god ideas that they learned is a problem and preventable. A rash of shootings going back for decades by people due to self created stupid ideas is kindof a problem, but unpreventable. Got it.

I also like the "narrative" that people need to go to special secret lairs abroad to "train" or get "radicalized". As if you can't expose yourself to every idea on earth and research some good attack methods on any of the world's billions of handheld electronic devices.

 

[lowry99]

--- Twelve pipe bombs, 2,000 9-millimeter rounds and 2,500 .223 rounds were found at a home the suspects were renting in Redlands. Also found were “hundreds of tools, many of which could be used to construct IEDs or pipe bombs.”

Quick -- let's shut down every Home Depot so we can focus on the "real issue" and avoid calling people terrorists.

 

[NickleDimer]

Quick - let's call people terrorists so we can focus on... um... I didn't have a second step.

 

[NorCalVU10]

The issue with gun control is that as long as the NRA is allowed to pump money to politicians, there won't be enough support to get anything done on a national level. So the way to stop the NRA is to stop/change the political lobby system. Unfortunately for democrats, they can't do that becuase there are 35 organizations/companies which donated more to democats than the NRA donates to rebuplican (oh yeah and nearly $4MM to democrats as well). Its a broken system that is built to be all about talk and not about action, and at the end of the day, all most people care about is what they hear (oh and how many likes they get on their progressive gun control tweet/facebook post).

 

[adp98]

It has much less to do with money and more to do with the voters the issue delivers. The anti-gun people have money to. Such a common mistake. The gun maniacs vote on that single issue more than the anti-gun maniacs. That's the issue, not the money. Everyone now has money for a given cause. I actually pitched Sandy Hook Promise a few months back. The money is everywhere, that's not the issue at all.

 

[LizReed]

Praying for the victims and making sure every mass shooter is called a terrorist is all we can do.

 

[Mr. Wade Garrett]

Did anyone see Anthony Jeselnik's standup on Netflix? (It largely sucked)

But he made the point when blowhards say "my thoughts and prayers" are with the victims for any tragedy, really all theyre saying is "Dont forget about me in all of this."

Its effing true. Get over yourself.

 

[NorCalVU10]

It has much less to do with money and more to do with the voters the issue delivers. The anti-gun people have money to. Such a common mistake. The gun maniacs vote on that single issue more than the anti-gun maniacs. That's the issue, not the money. Everyone now has money for a given cause. I actually pitched Sandy Hook Promise a few months back. The money is everywhere, that's not the issue at all.

ADP, I think what you're saying is what I mean - because the money is everywhere, no one is going to tear down the lobby system. I doubt the pro-gun voters mobilize the same way if it werent for the NRA.

 

[adp98]

My point is it's not the "lobby system" that makes the NRA strong. It's their grassroots and ability to turn out voters on a single issue.

 

[NickleDimer]

Through all this, I can see how people who in rural america are very concerned about someone "taking away" their guns and take that concern to the voting booth. It's a scary to think that first responders are a loooong ways from you if sh*t goes down. Fear is a very powerful selling point.

 

[adp98]

This is an issue I find in interesting. It's not about money, it's about having enough people who make up the rational center on gun control issues to sychronize their voice in the same manner as the gun wacko's. I go to the NRA to shoot guns and there isn't enough money in the world for me to ever represent them. That day of commonsense reform is going to come. I thought it would be after Sandy Hook but at some point there needs to be some commonsense reforms. I'll wait for folks to tell me how the perfect is the enemy of the better in terms of reforms. Our gun laws are just dumb and I've go no issues with people owning guns. I'll even have them in my own home.

 

[NickleDimer]

Adp is right. It's lazy journalism that talks about the influence of NRA money. Yesterday some dolt was tweeting congresspeople's condolences alongside their campaign contributions from the NRA.

 

[lowry99]

Thing is, I can live with the fear of someone in my office or some other place me or my family frequent going bat$hit and shooting the place up. Despite the media attention, we're still way short of the threshold where you're close to the number of people that die each year from random, trivial $hit. A couple hundred people a year or so? Tragic if you're affected just like any car accident or negligent act that leads to death or serious injury, but random.

The Jihadists are different. The only thing stopping them from killing tens or hundreds of thousands of people is access to the technology. I can't see someone who got fired from their job, or even a guy who is crazy and feels isolated like Lanza/Sandy Hook, trying to access and having the means to access and use a nuclear or chemical weapon that could kill tens or hundreds of thousands of people -- enough for centuries more of routine wacko shootings.

On the other hand, any one of these thousands of jihadi a$$holes would do it if they had the opportunity, and they're actively consipiring every day to kill as many as possible, trading tips, building on their collective knowledge, etc. That is their mission.

The gun control debate distracts from that problem in my view. Two different issues.

 

[HereComeTheCats]

Did anyone see Anthony Jeselnik's standup on Netflix? (It largely sucked)

But he made the point when blowhards say "my thoughts and prayers" are with the victims for any tragedy, really all theyre saying is "Dont forget about me in all of this."

Its effing true. Get over yourself.

 

[NorCalVU10]

But what about how few people have died from terrorism vs guns?


And ADP - point taken, they donate lots because they have a voter base. I point to the money because it is representative of their influence - and that no one wants that money to go away, on either side of the aisle (see unions).

 

[Mr. Wade Garrett]

The thing i find fascinating with the radical jihadist faction is that it is an anti-intellectual, anti-progressive movement in a time when the world is moving at relatively light speed.

Access to information (factual information, not religious "information") has never been greater to such a high percentage of the human race. And yet, a de-evolutionary movement seems to be gaining popularity in large number of countries. Its not even from a fascist regime, as the internet should provide access to separate worldviews.

There is something innately flawed in either the Arab culture, or the Muslim religion.
Its truly fascinating.

 

[NickleDimer]

does the "gun lobby" even spend 1% of when pharma or big insurance or energy/oil companies or defense contractors spend on lobbying?