76"ers
- Thread starter cleanwave
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NickleDimer
Post 'Til Your Fingers Bleed
You're ignoring that Noel played great on the some of the possessions where the Celtics did not score.
I don't think Noel played great last night. The team stunk on a whole, especially defensively. They are not very good. This has been established. I do think Noel has had a good year and has progressed nicely. I don't think he is anywhere close to his ceiling. I will never use one game, or two games, or ten games, etc to judge a player. Noel's defensive numbers this year are rather solid. If a dopey poster wants to use Tyler Zeller having a good game as reason why someone isn't any good then go right ahead, continue to be dopey.
NickleDimer
Post 'Til Your Fingers Bleed
NickleDimer
Post 'Til Your Fingers Bleed
Well, "making progress this year" would mean not sitting out the whole season with a knee injury. So he can check "making progress" off on his list of goals. I still see him as a Sammy Dalembert, clumsy with the ball non-franchise cornerstone type player. Continue persecuting people for sports opinions that differ from yours, though.
NickleDimer
Post 'Til Your Fingers Bleed
NickleDimer
Post 'Til Your Fingers Bleed
your evaluation of noel is like failing an open book test
the answers are right there in front of you, and yet you're too f--king stupid to see
only a complete dumbass would be disappointed
the answers are right there in front of you, and yet you're too f--king stupid to see
only a complete dumbass would be disappointed
CWertz, he's top 10 in defensive +/- right now. It's undeniable that he is a very effective defensive player - he has the glory stats (blocks/steals) and vastly improves his team's overall D when on the floor. If those stats change next year I'll re-consider
All I know is, there have been too many times this season when slow stiffs have career nights against the guy. I think those stats are useless considering he really does not help them win games. He helps them against the Knicks, who actually have less talent right now but that's about it. Two below average Celtics centers completely abused him. Could he turn out to be okay? Maybe but I don't believe he will ever be a real offensive option and he still needs to actually defend.
One thing is for sure, you will get banned again and I won't. Someone who gets banned is pretty "f--king stupid", don't you think? Maybe when Noel is 25, he will average more than 10 points a game. Yeah, what a real stud. His less than two blocks a game are making a huge difference alright.
Cwertz is a Celtics fan. He watched Olynyk and Zeller have pretty good games against Noel/Sixers two months apart. He's used these small sample size to draw his conclusions. He continues to mention that Noel's offense won't be any good. However, most of is already know that Noel doesn't need to be more than a 10-12 PPG guy at some point. His value is down the other end on a good team. You don't watch the Sixers every night. If you did then you would see the kid's improvement. It's as obvious as it gets. Please, more on because you're out of your league here. His defensive numbers are excellent considering his experience to date and thru are only going to get better.
Nine points and seven boards against the Lakers last night. The beat goes on for Noel. I am far from a Celtics fan but I just don't get how this guy is a stud in your eyes.
You are correct about one thing, I don't watch the Sixers every night. I didn't know there were too many that did that. Something is honestly missing, if you feel the urge to watch that pathetic team every night. They sure do play hard but I guess so, they are all fighting to stay in the NBA. I have watched enough to know that Noel will never be a top tier player. Considering this guy was at one time suppose to be the #1 pick in the draft, I would expect more than a defensive specialist. I guess I'll "more' on from here.
I'm saying he is not even a defensive stud, we all know he is raw on the offensive end. Who is he stopping on the defensive end? It's like saying Allen Iverson was a good defensive player because he had a lot of steals but in reality, he was a horrible defender.
I will say one thing in the Sixers defense, the 2013 NBA draft was pretty bad overall. If the Sixers wind up with the #1 pick somehow, they are going to have to take Okafor of course. This means someone has to get moved. Who would the Sixers move?
Dude, he's 20 years old, has played about 85 games of NBA/college combined, and weights like 215 lbs. He's not going to physically beat up on opposing interior players who outweight him by 40-60 lbs at this point. C'mon, keep it in perspective some. However, he does protect the rim and he does get a ton of deflections right now. He routinely picks guards out front with quick hands. I have seen very few big men over my time have this skill. There are defensive metrics that show he has been very good this year (If I have the time I'll try to find and share). He's made progress across the board this year.
I'll repeat what my projection for him is. I don't think he'll ever be considered a main offensive threat on a good team. 10-12 ppg is probably his ceiling. I think he can get you ten board per game in time. I think he will be an All-NBA defensive type player probably sooner than later. He's already in the top ten in blocks and steals. On a good team he can provide some of the things that Joakim Noah does for the Bulls. And while we're at it, look at Noah's first two years in the league. Then, go look at D. Jordan's first five years. And if you want I'll cite other examples of bigs who don;t exactly start tearing up the best league in the world after 80 games of college/NBA.
The Sixers aren't drafting J. Okafor if they get the first pick. Well, maybe they will, but then I'd expect them to move him for somethign else. Again, if they draft another big because that player is clearly the best player on the board, then you do it and worry about who you move later on. In the end, if they traded Noel because his position was crowded on the roster, then that's fine as long as they get a good young player back for him. Regardless, if it's here ort someplace else my expectations for Noel remain the same.
I'll repeat what my projection for him is. I don't think he'll ever be considered a main offensive threat on a good team. 10-12 ppg is probably his ceiling. I think he can get you ten board per game in time. I think he will be an All-NBA defensive type player probably sooner than later. He's already in the top ten in blocks and steals. On a good team he can provide some of the things that Joakim Noah does for the Bulls. And while we're at it, look at Noah's first two years in the league. Then, go look at D. Jordan's first five years. And if you want I'll cite other examples of bigs who don;t exactly start tearing up the best league in the world after 80 games of college/NBA.
The Sixers aren't drafting J. Okafor if they get the first pick. Well, maybe they will, but then I'd expect them to move him for somethign else. Again, if they draft another big because that player is clearly the best player on the board, then you do it and worry about who you move later on. In the end, if they traded Noel because his position was crowded on the roster, then that's fine as long as they get a good young player back for him. Regardless, if it's here ort someplace else my expectations for Noel remain the same.
Eric Gordan had 23 last night for the Pelicans, so D. Jordan didn't protect the rim either. Michael Kidd-Gilcrist/Gerald Henderson shot a combined 15-22 last night (35 points), so I guess 20-year old Andrew Wiggins won't ever be a good defensive player. Jesus Christ you are so out of your league with this stuff.
I don't know if the Sixers would take Okafor. My sense is that they wouldn't, even if they had the first pick. If they wanted another big, then I think they take Karl towns before him. Again, just my sense. Furthermore, they have the third worse record and chance to finish with sasy the fourth record. So, the sixers pick could fall anywhere between 1-6 or 1-7. There is a reasonable chance that they aren't even in position tot ake Okafor. Another reason is they already have Embiid. To me, if you think Embiid is the guy, then there is no need to get Okafor.
Okafor is polished offensively, but he's not in great shape, he doesn't play above the rim, and leaves a lot to be desired on the defensive end. But please, tell me why they would have to take him if they had the #1 pick?
Yes, Noel can play PF next to someone like Embiid or Okafor. It would also be possible for one of them to play the 4 defensively, but then the 5 on offense. There are 96 minutes to divide up on the PF/C positions. There are ways to do it.
I don't know if the Sixers would take Okafor. My sense is that they wouldn't, even if they had the first pick. If they wanted another big, then I think they take Karl towns before him. Again, just my sense. Furthermore, they have the third worse record and chance to finish with sasy the fourth record. So, the sixers pick could fall anywhere between 1-6 or 1-7. There is a reasonable chance that they aren't even in position tot ake Okafor. Another reason is they already have Embiid. To me, if you think Embiid is the guy, then there is no need to get Okafor.
Okafor is polished offensively, but he's not in great shape, he doesn't play above the rim, and leaves a lot to be desired on the defensive end. But please, tell me why they would have to take him if they had the #1 pick?
Yes, Noel can play PF next to someone like Embiid or Okafor. It would also be possible for one of them to play the 4 defensively, but then the 5 on offense. There are 96 minutes to divide up on the PF/C positions. There are ways to do it.
I do not see the Sixers ending up with Okafor under any circumstances, weather they have the opportunity to draft him or not.
Interesting question: who is in a better position right now, the Sixers or the Celtics? Who legitimately contends for the East sooner of these two teams?
Interesting question: who is in a better position right now, the Sixers or the Celtics? Who legitimately contends for the East sooner of these two teams?
That's like asking who had a better NCAA Tournament, Villanova or Virginia. Both had horrible tournaments. I think the Sixers have more potential upside, if their plan works out but I still think the chances of their overall plan working out is low.
Dmil, I agree with you on Okafor/Sixers. with that said, anything is possible with Hinkie, so I won;t say no chance. I just don't see it.
I see two scenarios where they could end up with him or at least have his rights for a short time. One, they get the first or second pick. A team right below them wants him bad. The Sixers draft/swap picks, add another asset, in a draft day trade scenario. The other possibility is that Okafor drops to a point in the draft where he falls to the Sixers and he is clearly the best player available. think 3rd thru 5th range. However, I think this option is remote. The first option I see as a real possibility if the Sixers get the 1st or 2nd pick.
Cwertz, just a little update for you buddy. Here are some of Noel's current rankings in the entire NBA.
Bocks - 7th (block % is also 7th)
Steals - 10th (steal % is 6th)
He is the ONLY player in NBA in the top 10 in both of these categories. Only one other player is in the top 20 of both.
Defensive rating - 6th (Again in the entire NBA; go look at the names on that top 10 list)
Defensive win shares - 5th
Defensive Box plus/minus - 2nd
FG% against - 9th (As of two weeks ago)
Based on these numbers he should get All-NBA Defense consideration despite only scratching his potential.
Bocks - 7th (block % is also 7th)
Steals - 10th (steal % is 6th)
He is the ONLY player in NBA in the top 10 in both of these categories. Only one other player is in the top 20 of both.
Defensive rating - 6th (Again in the entire NBA; go look at the names on that top 10 list)
Defensive win shares - 5th
Defensive Box plus/minus - 2nd
FG% against - 9th (As of two weeks ago)
Based on these numbers he should get All-NBA Defense consideration despite only scratching his potential.